"I've never had any contacts with policymakers. Those who run the banks are the administrators, "said Joe Berardo in the round of issues of Communist deputy Duarte Alves.
"How did Metalgest, which had 50,000 euros turnover and a negative EBTIDA, obtained a credit of 50 million euros?" Asked the deputy and the answer was: "Ask the Caixa", answered the owner of Metalgest , Joe Berardo.
This loan was "to buy shares listed on the stock exchange, mostly for BCP," Berardo replied. This was in 2006.
I asked for money to buy stocks and "it did not work out. I'm not the only one, "Berardo said. Already initially Berardo's lawyer, André Luiz Gomes had said that Caixa had a pledge on BCP's shares with a mandate to sell. "If Caixa had used this prerogative, and sold it when the shares ceased to cover the value of the loans, it would not have recorded losses," he said.
Berardo spoke of the fall in BCP shares, recalling that the loan had a "stop loss" clause for sale as soon as the shares fell to a certain value. But "banks said 'wait, wait'. "So what's the deal?" Says Berardo who asked. "That will be seen later," he told CGD.
The Berardo Collection Association is given as an attachment to the banks, but not to the art collection, Cecília Meireles of CSD had previously mentioned.
"The one who commands the association is management. I'm the one who chooses the administration. I'm the one in the association. Let them do the garnishment, "said the commander. Cecília Meireles said that if there is an execution, it stops sending in the association if the banks execute the association. "Ah-ah-ah," was Joe Berardo's response.
In issue is what was given as guarantee in the loan of the Foundation with Caixa: they were the titles of the association and not the art collection.
And that's why banks have trouble performing the warranty. He spoke of the action taken by the three creditor banks (including CGD and BCP). In a response to PSD deputy Duarte Marques, Joe Berardo said that an evaluation of the collection was going to cost "a kite", as envisaged in the pledge agreement. What the deputy countered: Caixa is that "it is costing a kite to many people". Joe Berardo did not stay: "Not me."
Ms. Cecilia Meireles earlier asked if the banks knew they could not execute the art collection when they gave the loans. "How can they perform the works if they are on display through contract?" Joe Berardo asked, explaining the reason for their reaction.
Cecilia Meireles recalled that until 2017 there was a contract, which was later renewed? "Yes. Banks knew that, "said Joe Berardo.
"What are the assets of the Berardo Collection Association, which pledged two 300 million euros in debt to Caixa?", Initially asked Mariana Mortágua.
"What the banks have is association bonds, they always knew that, and it was they who evaluated, I do not know what the valuation they made of the bonds was. Ask the financial institution, "says Berardo.
CGD "knew that it was not pledging works. They knew and accepted the association's titles. "
Banks as lienholders have a right to vote at the general assembly of the Berardo Collection Association, recalls Mortágua. Berado says that it is in the association's articles of association delivered when a restructuring agreement was signed which gave the banks credit, "if they did not exercise those rights, it is not my fault. Do they have the right or not? They may have but do not present themselves "in.
After saying that he personally had no debts, he was asked about "Quinta da Bacalhôa, is yours?" And the answer was "I have nothing".
At the beginning of the session, Berardo was confronted by a deputy from the PSD, in which he ironically told him: "Being you a business man, honorable", when will the Foundation and Metalgest loans be returned? The answer was "we are negotiating with the banks and we will see if we have reached a conclusion soon."
According to EY, Joe Berardo owed Caixa Geral de Depósitos (CGD) 320 million euros at the end of 2015, half of which the public bank was reported as lost.